In this episode of AdTech | AlikeAudience, Tim Martin, the Engagement Manager of Data Transformation at Merkle Australia, Derek Fan, the former Director of Business Development and Partnerships at AlikeAudience and Jessica Lam, the Founder of The Brand Creatives, discuss:
- • How you can truly understand your customers
- • Changes in the customer relationship management landscape
- • How external data vendors can uncover quality leads and drive your business’s reach
- • The consequences of the shift from third-party to first-party data
- • The benefits of consumer data platforms
Meet your host
Jessica Lam: Welcome to the third episode of AlikeAudience’s AdTech podcast, where we discuss the latest ad tech trends and industry insights in a series of interviews with industry leaders. I’m Jessica. I’m the Director of the brand Creatives, a boutique agency on brand content for tech companies, and I’m hosting the podcast today.
Introducing Tim Martin
Jessica Lam: We’ve invited Tim Martin, the Engagement Manager of Data Transformation at Merkle Australia to share with us how brands can realize the value of data and CXM, customer insights, audience activation and media optimization.
Tim has been involved with the internet since 1993. From the beginnings of paid search, Tim has decades of experience in customer interactivity, even before AdTech and programmatic was a buzzword. He has a wealth of experience as an entrepreneur, data consultant, and in customizing platforms for different applications to customer insights, and research and tracking.
Meet Derek Fan and Elice Lau
Jessica Lam: And next, I would also like to introduce Derek Fan, the Director of Business Development and Partnerships at AlikeAudience and Elice Lau, the Chief Strategy Officer at AlikeAudience. With a wealth of experience in data service startups, Derek currently drives commercial and go-to-market strategies with platform partners and media agencies worldwide.
Today they’ll both share their insights on understanding the customer journey and how businesses can succeed today. So perhaps I will kick off the podcast with a question for Tim. Welcome both of you to the podcast.
Tim, clearly, you’ve been in the industry for a long time. And you saw the evolution of the entire ad tech industry, from tech space browsers to very sophisticated tracking technologies today. And I’m wondering if you can share some insights on what businesses can learn from the past? And how do they adapt in a very constantly changing AdTech landscape today?
Understanding your target customers is key
Tim Martin: Yeah, sure. Thanks, Jessica. And thanks, Derek, for hosting me. Yes, that’s a great question. And where I would start would be to say that some of the basic tenets of the internet when it comes to advertising haven’t changed.
For example, understanding your users, so in the case of marketing, advertising, that’s obviously customers. Things like customer journeys, how people navigate through content, how people navigate through experiences, some of those things are very much as they are today as they were at the start of the internet.
Except that I would say due to the variety of platforms, the variety of content types, and the variety of AdTech and MarTech technologies, just putting together those simple customer journeys and understanding customer needs have become a far more complex and complicated piece.
The first thing is really just to continue to understand the users of your website, the users of your app, how people engage, whether it be B2B or B2C, how people are engaging with the content, the services, the e-commerce, that you’re providing as a business.
As I mentioned, those things were around in the very early days of the Internet, when people were putting together HTML web pages and constructing links, and navigation trees. They’re as relevant today as they are when thinking about a complex e-commerce website or an app deployment. So in many respects, understanding customers hasn’t changed.
Change is constant
Tim Martin: I think the second thing that hasn’t changed is something that you’ll probably hear if you attend regular yoga classes or other types of meditation, the only constant is change.
So the other thing is that even in the early days of the internet moving from textbase to browser to what-you-see-is-what-you-get through to different types of search engines, you know, we’ve all experienced the rise and fall of search engines. Alta Vista was one of the early ones that I was familiar with. And obviously, later down the track you’ve got search engines like Google that have come into dominance.
So in one respect, change is something that’s a constant — whether that’s the underlying ways that that content is built, or the way assets are connected and linked in pages, the types of use cases that have been deployed, whether it’s E-commerce, subscription, search engines, or social media, the plethora and the range of providers of brands, of publishers, of technologies, really the pace of that change has increased. So that would be one of the other things that I would say is that the internet essentially is almost like a symptom of rapid change.
New regulations drive changes in how data is used
Tim Martin: And if you look more recently, some of the changes would be in and around the use of data. So that would be in and around privacy regulations and the use of first, second, and third party data. That’s a major area of change driven more by regulation.
If you look at some of the media-based changes that are happening, it’s the way that people receive and engage with their content. So that would be, for example, news services or streaming services.
If you have a look at e-commerce, and even payments, if you look at some of the change that’s happening there, it’s the use of, you know, whether it be PayPal, a credit card or even Bitcoin. So every way, shape or form, the internet is synonymous with change.
As the internet develops, there is more and more change, driven by either responding to a regulation, by new technology, or by consumers themselves. So, I hope that helps. Consumer insights on one hand is a constant, change on the other.
.
How Merkle approaches CXM
Jessica Lam: So let’s talk a little bit about consumer insights. So I know Merkle’s approach is important for customer success. Could you talk a little bit more about how your agency approaches CXM?
Customer insights evolving into CXM
Tim Martin: Going back to the first point I made around customer insight, which is really around customer engagement–in the early days, when designing a desktop website, it was around how you created the links between the different web pages, what was the sort of the HTML linking and coding, and that could be a fairly basic structure.
The idea was to guide people through from start to finish, you know, whatever the task was, the way you’d link the structure, or the features or functions would be to accomplish that. So in the current days, obviously, that’s far more complex, far more complicated. So the term CXM is far more appropriate.
CXM must be all-encompassing
Tim Martin: Merkle is a leader in CXM, which stands for customer experience management. Ultimately, it’s recognition that we have a very fast-paced digital-first customer world where businesses and customers have a lot to gain and a lot to lose.
There’s a pressure amongst businesses and service providers like us to support and enable businesses and customers to get the most, the best in terms of experiences, technology, content, applications and data.
CXM in the Merkle world is very much an all-encompassing concept, which deals primarily with the customer and business experience. Data transformation, which is how businesses utilize data to enhance customer experience through digital transformation, is very much around deploying techniques, whether it’s design thinking, user experience, or prototyping techniques: all sorts of creative techniques to design, develop, and test the delivery, the creative and the building delivery of customer experience in an agile way.
Customers are the focal point of CXM
Tim Martin: And I guess the last piece to that really is around platforms. So you know, investment in DMP, for example, or a CDP or some sort of AdTech or MarTech to facilitate personalization.
Customer experience, CXM, has quite a broad definition, but ultimately, it’s driven by the word customer, which as I mentioned before, has its roots in the early days of the internet as much as it does in modern times. So, think data, technology, and customer experience. These are all important parts of CXM.
Jessica Lam: Thank you, Tim. So it seems that the focus on customer experience is quite important for brands. And, Derek, I know you’ve consulted on many brands on scaling up their first-party strategy. Can you also share some of your insights on that, along with Tim’s?
The shift from third-party to first-party data
Derek Fan: Sure, and thank you so much for having me again, on another episode of the AlikeAudience podcast that’s not about connected TV this time. And it’s very nice to cross paths with you again, Tim.
So I think with the landscape, having such a big component of audience targeting going away, which is third party cookies, marketers definitely need to place first-party data as the top priority.
As Tim said, customer experience really boils down to your customers, so your first-party data, what you know about them. In order to move forward without third party cookies, brands will need to continually invest in acquiring new prospects, especially through their digital channels if they haven’t already done so.
Brands are going digital-first
Derek Fan: This really depends on the nature of your business, the degree to which you can actually gather data about customers can be very different. For example, in an e-commerce website, you would have a wide range of very valuable PII you can work with such as usernames, logins, email addresses, loyalty programs, even physical addresses.
This is all on top of the behavioral attributes that they are already gathering, such as the browsing behaviors on the e-commerce site, the search behaviors on the e-commerce site, their past purchases.
But if you think, on the other hand, a CPG brand is going to be at a relatively disadvantaged position, really, and this is due to again, the nature of their business. They rely on retail partners and distribution channels to get their products on the shelves and to consumers. So now, when we consult with brands, we’re seeing a lot of brands shifting towards a digital-first approach. CPG brands in particular are moving towards direct-to-consumer channels.
Data vendors can give you quality leads and extend your reach
Derek Fan: At AlikeAudience, when we consult with clients that have this gap, we really try to push them to start thinking about how they want their target audiences to learn about their business and interact with their brands, especially in digital environments.
Even for brands that already have a number of different data sources and data traffic across their digital properties, it’s still important to bear this concept in mind–because once third party cookies are blocked, tracking will stop and no new information will be added.
From a data targeting perspective, again, how are you going to source quality leads? And I believe this is where revisiting your top of funnel strategy will kickstart this first-party data collection process. Once you have an idea of the types of users you want to target, working with data companies and external data sources can accelerate this process by helping you acquire larger volumes of audiences and prospects in a shorter amount of time, and give you that incremental reach that you would need to get off the ground to drive brand awareness and really fill your sales funnel with quality prospects.
From that point on, the cycle continues. So like Tim mentioned, you start analyzing again, what’s working in driving your KPI and your overall customer journey and what is not, you will get a sense of what might be the next best action or next best touchpoint to enhance to reach, engage better with your customer, and being agile enough to really make those changes quickly. So you can tailor offerings to match the most up to date interests and preferences of your users, which is the essence of a CDP.
How should businesses choose their CDP vendors?
Jessica Lam: Thank you Derek, for the insight that was very helpful. So let’s talk a little bit more about CDPs then. Derek and Tim, would you have advice on how businesses should choose and implement their vendors? And do you have any specific advice around CDP specifically?
CDPs can replace DMPs in the future
Tim Martin: I’m happy to chip in Derek. CDPs are an emerging technology that most brands will have heard of in some shape or form. To some degree, I suppose it’s a substitute or a future replacement for a DMP.
The focus of a CDP is clearly collecting and managing first-party data. Even considering the role of a CDP in a client’s business is really the first point because the CDP could fulfill a number of functions. It could fulfill a function around data unification, for example. It could fulfill a function around analytics. So understanding what your customers are doing on your own digital platform, whether that be desktop, mobile, app, beyond that.
They also can play a role in terms of things like activation, so that could be re-engaging existing customers or helping determine from a set of anonymous visitations, you know, some segments that might have a future, next best action or propensity to engage or buy from your business. The main thing about CDPs is that each one of the CDP vendors has a range of features and functions that it’s good at doing. There’s not one CDP that’s built to be a specialist across all the possible use cases. That’s one aspect.
Alignment of CDP for best results
Tim Martin: The second aspect is obviously aligning in a business where a CDP or an investment in a CDP would best sit with the data team, or the Information Technology team. Or for example, a marketing team or even the loyalty team so there are aspects and around considering CDPs around use cases, but also stakeholders in the business who stand to gain and perhaps have the most to benefit, through considerations around privacy and consent, data collection, use of that data.
CDPs collaborating with analytics providers
Tim Martin: And outside of the out of the box features and functions of a CDP, what sort of analytics, machine learning, or some bespoke analytics, what types of cloud-based services would also complement that CDP.
Some examples are sophisticated scoring of first-party customer engagement using algorithms that run on Amazon, working hand in hand with CDP to predict or determine what that personalized message’s next action could be, an email, content, or an SMS. So CDPs do have a very important role when it comes to first-party data.
Benefits of CDPs
Tim Martin: That said, CDPs also have an important role when it comes to considering data enrichment. That’s probably another area that Derek might be interested in delving into. CDP to some degree is a useful platform for a single source of truth or a single source of data storage, providing that the CDP vendor has got those features and functions available or can be bought together with some cloud-based data storage or cloud-based analytics services.
Lots of considerations in terms of investing in, deploying, implementing, and delivering the benefits that CDPs offer. Probably more complex, I would say, than implementing a DMP, using third-party cookies, which as Derek mentioned, is something that has been superseded because of the demise of third-party cookies. So dealing with first-party data brings its own complexities and nuances, in addition to a CDP implementation.
Jessica Lam: Thank you, Tim. And so it definitely sounds a little more complicated than the DMP. And what about you, Derek? Do you have any thoughts on CDPs or data enrichment?
Centralization of data to offer personalized messaging
Derek Fan: The concept that Tim brought up is that CDPs is all about centralizing your disparate data and traffic sources across all the different marketing initiatives and touchpoints you have going on and then ultimately, having that single customer view or that single source of data storage, so you can deliver personalized messaging and tailored experiences. I think today with the help of data, you can customize your marketing, marketing messages to different users all at different stages of your customer journey.
Data enrichment builds a 360-view of your ideal customer and drives better decisions
Derek Fan: From a data enrichment perspective, it’s all about taking into consideration who your target customers are, what are their purchase channels and touchpoints that are most relevant to them?
For example, what reasons or triggers are pushing your customers to buy? What shopping channels are moving them down your sales funnel? And one key question that we AlikeAudience as a data company, we help marketers solve is, what does your most important customer look like? And how can we help you dig deeper into the segment?
In addition to how they’ve interacted with your brand in the past, whether that’s subscribing to your newsletter, clicked on an ad of yours, visited your website, etc. In addition to all of these, what more about them? Can you uncover, for example, their demographic information like average age, gender, household income, their life stage, their other interests?
Working with external data sources outside of your own marketing touchpoints allows you to enrich your existing data and enrich what you already know about your customers. It’s really a way for you to fill in gaps and color to your current understanding of your consumers and discover more patterns, which in turn puts you one step closer to a really a truly 360-degree view of the customers who are actually purchasing your products.
What this ultimately does is help you make the most informed decisions on how to improve your segmentation, your targeting tactics and messaging while scaling up your first-party data.
Navigate the new normal with data vendors that add value
Derek Fan: At AlikeAudience, we help brands make these informed decisions through our data universe. And that helps you uncover more information about your customers that you may not have direct access to, for example, additional information about the person’s socio-economic statuses, their household income and composition, more visibility into the person’s past purchase behaviors outside of your brand, their interaction with your competitor brands and just general mobile behaviors that would shed more light into the lifestyle behaviors of that user.
I would recommend to marketers that are navigating through this new normal that if you decide to work with an external data source, do make sure that they can add proper value from their universe into the existing profiles of your core customers.
In that way, you can then drive better outcomes through the different channels that you have going on. Like Tim said, maybe as the SMS, as a channel, as a touchpoint would be the most effective in engaging with your customer. And so having those data sources would allow you to do that.
Future of data collection and AdTech
Jessica Lam: Thank you. So I think we’ve covered a lot of ground in our questions today. And I thought it was really helpful what Tim said about the constant change in the industry and that businesses have to just adapt to that. And we also covered a little bit on first-party strategy and CDPs and CXM and as well as data enrichment. So if we were to tie it all together, what do you think that the future of data collection and ad tech will look like? I know it’s hard to predict. But I would love to hear your thoughts on businesses.
Capturing data is becoming more complex
Tim Martin: Acouple of things to consider for businesses is that with the demise of first-party cookies, the solution is not just a technology enablement piece. For example, third party cookies were easy to tag up, it was easy to collect data in a DMP, and then run some segmentation, some clustering, cohorts or whatever you might think.
And then integrate those with action points, whether it’s trading platforms or programmatic, right, so that technology ecosystem essentially was set up to accommodate over a number of years, that third party, data-driven, cookie-based system.
Moving forward, we have more complexities around data capture, so that will consider more aspects of privacy, for example, and consent. So those processes become more closely looked at, in terms of privacy and regulation, and the legal aspects. The storage of that data, in terms of CDPs. Again, that’s essentially a new platform for a lot of businesses, you know, they haven’t had experience, they need to get it supported, whether it’s Merkle or the CDP vendors themselves. So that’s the second piece.
Mutually agreeing to exchange values
Tim Martin: The third piece is what you might call a value exchange with the customer. Remember, we talked about customers, things have got more complicated, there’s a lot more to offer, a lot more different channels, a lot more content.
Ultimately, customers are still looking for that value, right? Whether it’s to achieve some transactional outcome, gain some content, to perform a search order to buy something, or anything in between. So there is this value exchange concept, which is before you’re automatically tracked now, right, you’re not automatically tracked unless you agree to it. And the tracking really is on the basis of first-party data-driven measurement, tracking, capture.
So consumers then think, “Okay, shall I agree to that, or shall I not?” What’s the outcome for me as the consumer, what’s the value, right? Am I going to watch some trailers or some movies for free? That sounds like a good exchange. do I get $1.50 if I hand my data over, right? And that’s that their data has been used to promote more personalized offers. So I think that’s the big area, which is the value exchange between consumers and businesses, much more of a focus. So hopefully, those three areas are something that businesses will take into account as I mentioned. Off to you, Derek
A key question for marketers
Derek Fan: Sure. From my side, I think I can comment on the data perspective. I think for one, we’re definitely going through the next technological wave in our industry. And it’s still evolving as we speak.
I think a key question I would probably pose to our customers and just marketers in general out there is—how are you going to future proof your business in the upcoming cookieless landscape? And while you navigate the nuances of the different IDs that are going to be in the market, just make sure that your business is also agile enough to integrate with different leading alternative IDs out there, so you can continue to engage with customers seamlessly in the future.
I’m especially excited to see how all these different moving pieces and changes will fall into place in the near future of our industry, especially with the growing importance of first-party data and CDPs. Just knowing how to work with external partners and data sources would be able to help you facilitate this overarching transition that we’re going through.
Subscribe & Stay tuned!
Jessica Lam: Thank you, I love both your perspectives. I love the idea of businesses integrating with new identity solutions, and also I agree with Tim’s perspective of the value exchange. So thank you so much for taking the time to share your insights, Derek, and thank you, Tim. So you’ve brought a lot of value to businesses navigating the ad tech landscape today.
Thank you for listening to the podcast. For more podcast episodes from AlikeAudience, hit the subscribe button and don’t forget to leave us a review and tag us on social. Find out more about AlikeAudience’s audience segmentation offerings here and learn more about Merkle Australia here.
